Joe Horn 'no-billed'
Jul. 2nd, 2008 07:27 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
acoustics1220political topic: The U.S. Criminal Justice System
Joe Horn 'no-billed'
A grand jury in Houston chose not to indict Joe Horn for murder (if you don't know who Joe Horn is see linkbelow above). If you were on the grand jury, how would you vote and why?
Horn was not protecting HIS OWN property. I remember this incident when it happened, but only that two people were shot in the back, and that an old man did it.
Did Horn WAIT for these guys to show up? What was his intent? Surely the burglars didn't take so long that Horn had the time to get his gun, call the police, AND go outside; did they?
As far as what the grand jury decided, I cannot honestly say that I think they did their job. Perhaps they did, then again, maybe they didn't.
Do I think it's fair to black people who do the same thing and then get thrown in prison? The way I look at this, I wonder if a Black or Hispanic man could've done this and walked out scott-free, hands wiped clean, and 'no-billed' as Horn did yesterday. The answer? HECK NO.
Who knows? I am glad to see that Horn has remorse for the lives that were changed by his actions. THAT, most of all, may be his best punishment.
++
The above statements were made in response to a question given by my Race & Crime professor for the class I'm taking online, and now that I've had time to think about this issue (over the day, instead of studying) I've finally come to the realization that this decision that the grand jury made has quite thoroughly infuriated me. My previous response from above really does not even touch everything I would say now, or could have said because I just keep thinking, two young men could still be alive today.
In Texas, citizens here are given much more leeway as to the laws of self-defense and defense of our property. When your property is trespassed you shoot to kill. That's how it is here.
My issue with this case:
• Joe Horn was not protecting his own property.
• Joe Horn called the police, and then proceeded to get his shot gun.
• The person on the phone TOLD Joe Horn NOT TO GO OUTSIDE (at least 5 times).
• The person on the phone said NOT to shoot at the burglars.
• Joe Horn ignored the person's commands and went outside, then proceeded to tell the burglars that if they moved, he would shoot. Move and you're dead, he said twice, before proceeding to shoot at least 4 times [distinct shots were picked up on the recording].
Joe Horn took justice into his own hands and for his actions, two lives were taken for material things. I would not kill a person for burglarizing my neighbors home and having seen them carrying bags of things from their home. If it were HIS home getting burglarized, that would be an entirely different ballgame. But here, Horn committed vigilante justice, and the grand jury of Houston, Texas said 'That's alright with us.'
Texas - I am not a happy camper.
Had this situation been reversed, with 2 white males being the burglars, and the person with the shotgun being a minority, that grand jury would've made the shooter pay dearly. Not only would he have been indicted and taken to trial, but he would've been convicted and sentenced severely.
Had this been a BLACK MAN that had shot at 2 white burglars, the black man would've gone to prison; I am absolutely positive that this would come to pass.
12% of the population is African American. 70% of the population is Caucasion/non-Hispanic.
Statistics*1, stated that African Americans comprise less than 15 percent of the U.S. population but nearly 50 percent of all incarcerated offenders...Conversely, whites (non-Hispanics) are underrepresented compared to their presence in the population - they are more than 70 percent of the general population but just more than one-third (33.5 percent) of the prison population (Walker, et al. 343).
Joe Horn may be pardonable for wanting to help his neighbors in defending their property, but he executed his intent in the wrong manner. Horn executed two burglars with a shotgun, hitting them both in the back. Thus taking justice into his own hands. Horn was not in imminent danger. They were leaving the property. They had taken material things, better that than his neighbors lives. And Horn knew his neighbors were not home. HORN KNEW THIS FACT.
This particular Houston grand jury has now made it very clear that if one decides to kill burglars when they're running off with their loot (that belongs to the NEIGHBORS), it's okay. The truth of the matter? A minority would not get away with this without a trial. A grand jury would've never completely dropped a case like this if the minority had been the shooter.
Horn should have gone to trial. Horn should have at least suffered a trial along with public scrutiny and outrage. I hope Horn regrets what he did, I hope he regrets every single day of his life, because no life should be taken because of material things. Material possessions can be replaced. Better that, than the loss of a life. Or in this case, two.
++
Statistics*1
Walker, W, Spohn, C, & DeLone, M (2007). The Color of justice. Belmont: Thomson Wadsworth.
Also, if you'd like to share your own opinion on this situation, feel free to leave a comment. Or not. I can't guarantee a response you'll like, or even a response you'd understand, coming from me (or a response at all). If you've read this post and understood my anger, well then. Thanks for reading.
A grand jury in Houston chose not to indict Joe Horn for murder (if you don't know who Joe Horn is see link
Horn was not protecting HIS OWN property. I remember this incident when it happened, but only that two people were shot in the back, and that an old man did it.
Did Horn WAIT for these guys to show up? What was his intent? Surely the burglars didn't take so long that Horn had the time to get his gun, call the police, AND go outside; did they?
As far as what the grand jury decided, I cannot honestly say that I think they did their job. Perhaps they did, then again, maybe they didn't.
Do I think it's fair to black people who do the same thing and then get thrown in prison? The way I look at this, I wonder if a Black or Hispanic man could've done this and walked out scott-free, hands wiped clean, and 'no-billed' as Horn did yesterday. The answer? HECK NO.
Who knows? I am glad to see that Horn has remorse for the lives that were changed by his actions. THAT, most of all, may be his best punishment.
The above statements were made in response to a question given by my Race & Crime professor for the class I'm taking online, and now that I've had time to think about this issue (over the day, instead of studying) I've finally come to the realization that this decision that the grand jury made has quite thoroughly infuriated me. My previous response from above really does not even touch everything I would say now, or could have said because I just keep thinking, two young men could still be alive today.
In Texas, citizens here are given much more leeway as to the laws of self-defense and defense of our property. When your property is trespassed you shoot to kill. That's how it is here.
My issue with this case:
• Joe Horn was not protecting his own property.
• Joe Horn called the police, and then proceeded to get his shot gun.
• The person on the phone TOLD Joe Horn NOT TO GO OUTSIDE (at least 5 times).
• The person on the phone said NOT to shoot at the burglars.
• Joe Horn ignored the person's commands and went outside, then proceeded to tell the burglars that if they moved, he would shoot. Move and you're dead, he said twice, before proceeding to shoot at least 4 times [distinct shots were picked up on the recording].
Joe Horn took justice into his own hands and for his actions, two lives were taken for material things. I would not kill a person for burglarizing my neighbors home and having seen them carrying bags of things from their home. If it were HIS home getting burglarized, that would be an entirely different ballgame. But here, Horn committed vigilante justice, and the grand jury of Houston, Texas said 'That's alright with us.'
Texas - I am not a happy camper.
Had this situation been reversed, with 2 white males being the burglars, and the person with the shotgun being a minority, that grand jury would've made the shooter pay dearly. Not only would he have been indicted and taken to trial, but he would've been convicted and sentenced severely.
Had this been a BLACK MAN that had shot at 2 white burglars, the black man would've gone to prison; I am absolutely positive that this would come to pass.
12% of the population is African American. 70% of the population is Caucasion/non-Hispanic.
Statistics*1, stated that African Americans comprise less than 15 percent of the U.S. population but nearly 50 percent of all incarcerated offenders...Conversely, whites (non-Hispanics) are underrepresented compared to their presence in the population - they are more than 70 percent of the general population but just more than one-third (33.5 percent) of the prison population (Walker, et al. 343).
Joe Horn may be pardonable for wanting to help his neighbors in defending their property, but he executed his intent in the wrong manner. Horn executed two burglars with a shotgun, hitting them both in the back. Thus taking justice into his own hands. Horn was not in imminent danger. They were leaving the property. They had taken material things, better that than his neighbors lives. And Horn knew his neighbors were not home. HORN KNEW THIS FACT.
This particular Houston grand jury has now made it very clear that if one decides to kill burglars when they're running off with their loot (that belongs to the NEIGHBORS), it's okay. The truth of the matter? A minority would not get away with this without a trial. A grand jury would've never completely dropped a case like this if the minority had been the shooter.
Horn should have gone to trial. Horn should have at least suffered a trial along with public scrutiny and outrage. I hope Horn regrets what he did, I hope he regrets every single day of his life, because no life should be taken because of material things. Material possessions can be replaced. Better that, than the loss of a life. Or in this case, two.
Statistics*1
Walker, W, Spohn, C, & DeLone, M (2007). The Color of justice. Belmont: Thomson Wadsworth.
Also, if you'd like to share your own opinion on this situation, feel free to leave a comment. Or not. I can't guarantee a response you'll like, or even a response you'd understand, coming from me (or a response at all). If you've read this post and understood my anger, well then. Thanks for reading.
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no subject
Date: 2008-07-02 07:03 pm (UTC)I know what it's like to lose a sense of security, and I know what it's like to lose out on A LOT OF MONEY because of material things being taken. We've lost a fair amount of money on power tools FOR MY FATHER'S WORK because some guys in a black little compact car started to notice that my dad had some goods that they could maybe get some money out of at thrift stores. It took 2 and a half years to feel secure IN OUR OWN CUL-DE-SAC because of this, because not only did they come once, they came THE VERY NEXT WEEKEND to try and steal AGAIN. But by that time we had made the front of our home more secure with some various technology accessories, they drove off because they realized we were ready for them that time. I even went and followed them down the road to see where they went. (A neighborhood just down the street, which makes sense.)
Why couldn't you sign with your LJ name anyway? Don't want to be identified as one of my actual flist thinking I'll defriend and say 'F-off'?
I wouldn't have, I'm peeved more now than if that were to happen. I would've at least THANKED you for expressing your opinion.
And besides, the hypothetical situation you just gave is an entirely different situation. When it's your own property HERE IN TEXAS. You shoot to kill and its perfectly within your rights to do so. Horn shot 2 people DEAD for stealing FROM THE NEIGHBORS PROPERTY. HE was NOT in danger. They were leaving. And here in Houston, there are a lot of illegal aliens, but guess what? A lot of Hispanics are here to earn money for their families because heck, there's the whole 'American Dream' going on here. And white people don't like doing the dirty jobs anyway.
*sigh* I'm sorry if others get offended, but it is what it is. Discrimination still exists, racism is still out there, it's just a matter of accepting that a lot of people out there are too cowardly or ignorant to realize the injustice of it all.